Morgan Hill Students Lose Lawsuit Over Right To Wear Flag

MORGAN HILL (CBS SF) – The families several high school students who sued the Morgan Hill Unified School District for violating their free speech rights have lost their case.

On Cinco De Mayo, 2010, students at Live Oak High School were told to remove shirts, hats and other clothing bearing the American flag for fear that the articles would incite violence on campus.

The former principal told the boys to turn the shirts inside-out or go home. When the refused, the were asked to leave campus.

Parents claim that the demand violated the students’ first and fourteenth amendment rights.

A federal court ruled that Live Oak has the right to restrict a student’s free speech when it is likely to cause a substantial disruption.

The plaintiffs were John and Dianna Dariano, parents of Matt Dariano; Kurt and Julie Ann Fagerstrom, parents of Dominic Maciell; and Kendall and Joy Jones on behalf of Daniel Galli. The group was seeking damages including changing school policies to clearly state students’ rights, and reimbursement lawyer fees.

(Copyright 2011 by CBS SF. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.)

  • VoteObamaOutIn2012

    Welcome to the Hope & Change…

    • John

      If you want to incite violence over the American flag, get out of this country!

    • noseitall

      OK, wait a minute… what if American students were holding a Respect America day… would the school have prohibited Mexican students from wearing the Mexican flag? I think we already know the answer to that.
      First, they ask for “equal rights”, then it always morphs into preferential hiring, quotas, and special programs only for them.

    • bluevelvet

      I feel like I’m living in an alternate, distorted dimension. Maybe they will have more right to wear an al qaeda flag instead. That’s what’s flying over Tripoli, Libya now.

    • teaisstronger


      This court decision proves that the people who honor our Flag are now as despised as the Flag. . The Suicide book proves beyond a doubt that White American will be destroyed unless we create our own sovereign homeland right here in North America. Its time to plan for the Partitioning of the USA into two nations, one Free and one like North Korea.

      Only TEA can set you free now.

    • Chris

      So if protesting the killing of Jews in Hitler’s Germany would have caused substantial disruption…I get it…that is why it was OK to kill Jews. I am so glad that the U. S. court system is soooo….. into free speech!

    • cubanfreedom

      would you seriously expect a different decision from Judge JAMES WARE? he is a liar and gay (see his Wiki bio) and needless to say based on this decision hates America.

    • Terry

      The school should have forced the students taking umbrage at the US flag to turn themselves inside out or leave the country!

    • Andy

      This was just a matter of time. These same people and some of you here have been denigrating the Confederate Battle Flag for being a hate symbol too. Now you’re wearing the shoe. How is that working out for you? Pretty good eh?

      • Chris

        Not me brother…God Save the South! “Deo Vindice” !!!

    • Edward Boothe

      And goodby to our country

    • Robert Ellison

      not only that, but i can’t wait for “THE BIG ONE” to finally happen, and submerge communist california into the sea…

      nothing good comes from san francisco…

      and then there is the matter of eliminating all the liberal judges…

      • Ray

        The following is a cut and paste from Wikipedia regarding the Judges that reached this treasonous verdict:
        “Ware’s nomination unraveled amid an embarrassing scandal that ultimately resulted in a judicial reprimand, and Clinton withdrew his nomination of Ware on November 27, 1997.[5] In 1998, Judge Ware was reprimanded by the Judicial Council of the Northern District Court of California for fabricating the story of being the brother of Virgil Ware,[6] a 13 year old black boy shot by white teenagers in Alabama in 1963 on the same day as the 16th Street Baptist Church bombing. According to a story Judge Ware had told many audiences, he was riding his bike with his brother Virgil on the handlebars when Virgil was shot and killed by white racists.[7] The incident was a real one, however it happened to a different James Ware, as was discovered when Judge Ware’s claim was published in the Alabama papers after he was nominated to the Ninth Circuit by President Bill Clinton. The father of the long-ago slain boy contacted the Alabama courts to report that the California judge was impersonating his own son James Ware who was an employee in a Birmingham power plant. The Alabama courts contacted the California courts, who convened the ethics hearing. Judge Ware was reprimanded but allowed to retain his lifetime appointment as district judge.[8]

        In 1998, Clinton appointed Kim McLane Wardlaw to the seat to which Ware had been nominated.”

        I suspect this man may have been put before a wall and shot had he uttered such a hateful thing against the Country in the 1940’s. Today the Left no doubt celebrates him and regards the liar as a hero.

      • Whaasza Matta Wityouz

        Calif. is a great state, just because you have a creepy mayor for S.F. doesn’t mean the whole state sucks besides there has always been a difference between S. Cal and N. Cal

      • Jimbo

        Happy Veteran’s day. Is this what I pay thousands of dollars to the Morgan Hill School district for? Maybe we should just raise the Mexican flag and call it quits?

      • Big Bear

        Eliminate the liberal judges. By any means necessary…

      • Brian1836

        The only people that should be offended by the American flag are its enemies. I strongly oppose China & Iran but I would never oppose the display of their flag in their own country. It’s a very sad day, especially on this Veteran’s Holiday, when the USA flag is legally recognized as a hate symbol. If there wasn’t a date on the article, one could easily interpret this as a decision made by the British Empire against the 13 colonies back in the 1700’s.

      • Logicalfallacy

        So if I understand this correctly, and I know I do, these students would have been fine if they were wearing red, white and GREEN on their shirts representing the mexi flag because that would not have incited violence on campus? If the mexi’s on campus decided to replace the American flag on campus with theirs, would they allow it because it might incite? Sounds like mobocracy – sort of what Ann Coulter writes about in her book.

    • ShadowPatriot64

      Stories such as this show the trouble that has befallen this nation. We all need to pray for America. This video is one of my favorites and is timely and needed in the US today. Prayer for America – – Here is the video link. Please share with your friends – copy and paste link if hyperlink not showingl

    • Fuzzy

      “A federal court ruled that Live Oak has the right to restrict a student’s free speech when it is likely to cause a substantial disruption.” —

      Then what is the purpose of free speech – just to agree with everyone?

      • RJ OGuillory


        ..exactly,…not only is the ruling “cooked”,..but what about the school district’s inability to understand their role in developing the skills these kids need to learn in order to interact, disagree and debate,…yet “not resort to violence”,…?

        …ironically,…the school administration resorted to violence when those who disagreed with them were threatened with violent removal from school grounds,
        …yet the administration doesn’t see that?…….that’s effing funny….

        ….poor thought process and poor performance from a “teaching perspective”
        ,…I’d fire the entire Live Oak Staff and send them to an educational seminar involving Coaches Paterno & Sandusky,…and the entire Penn State University Staff….maybe the would make better decisions?


        RJ O’Guillory
        Webster Groves-The Life of an Insane Family

      • Mike Fritz

        To suggest that an American flag shirt would cause a disruption is to suggest that Mexicans are disruptive people. That in and of itself is racist. Of course, we all know that the 5th of May has nothing to do with Mexican independence, and is not even considered a holiday in the majority of Mexico.

      • Linda

        students don’t get free speech in secondary schools. supreme court ruled that ages ago. “if if will cause trouble’ or some similar wording . . . .

      • newjerseybt


        Many of those high school “kids” CAN sign a contract. Also go to war and die. Therefore they ARE adults at age 18.

      • NY9Solyndra

        “Then what is the purpose of free speech – just to agree with everyone?”

        Adults can do all kinds of things that are protected under the Constitution, however, not all those rights extend to minors, especially when they are attending public schools.

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        Fuzzy: Not all speech is considered free speech. For example, fighting words, inciting hysteria, etc. Also, courts have ruled (*sigh*) that students at public schools give up some of their freedoms of expression once they enter campus. The purpose of this is so that they can focus on school material, not protesting one cause or another.

        (Please, don’t take this to mean I agree with the court’s decision, as I do not. I only want to help you understand free speech. Also, to those who will undoubtedly call me out on this: try speaking (typing) respectfully. It’s not difficult… Give it a shot..)

      • George K

        That is the DEFINITION of free speech, according to the current administration. Not the PURPOSE of free speech.

      • Ray Dodd

        No, just to agree with the libs!

      • EJ Diaz

        Good point Fuzzy. I agree with such a rule that it is good to avoid what may cause a substantial disruption, like wearing something morally offensive or just plain going to school naked, but we’d be fools if we only focus on eliminated that which causes substiantial disruption. Man, if I stopped my kid from doing anything that freaked out his younger sister, 2 things would be true: he’d have to stay in bed all day, and little sis’ would soon learn that the world revolves around her. The group that freaks out over a citizen being patriotic in his own country is clearly in the wrong and is not being helped at all by this ruling.

    • Michael J

      you have GOT to be kidding me! What a weak and pathetic country we have become! Since when do we need to apologize for being American in our own dang country? Next thing you know, we won’t be able to fly the American flag anywhere on Cinco de Mayo either.

      • Big Bear

        Instead of filing these lawsuits, the parents need to pull their children out of the public schools, vote NO on any levies for school funding, stage a property tax revolt to deny these government schools money, and start their own schools where American values can be taught.

        As for the teachers and administrators at the Communist schools, they can go occupy something.

  • Mike Alright

    As the feminized US FALLS. If you join the armed services of this nanny-state loving country, you do not fight for freedom. You fight for FEMINISM.

    • Andy

      As a medically retired Marine of 16 years service, I can’t help but agree with you.

    • LOL

      Clearly you didn’t earn the right to wear balls.

    • USArmyCombatMedic

      I understand you are upset, as am I. Please take care not to insult those of us who have chosen to serve their country.

      • john

        Says the guy that probably makes more than the average military member! I don’t understand why anyone in this country can insult the military. They are the people that will defend you at all cost even if you don’t like them.

      • Mark

        You are not serving your country, you are empowering an evil political machine

      • Mark O.

        Mark, until you’ve served in the military you haven’t earned the right to have an opinion.

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        Noooooooooooo…. Every American has this basic right.

      • MarkIsWrong

        Mark O. Nonsense. Its the non-military people who pay for the military, and yes they have opinions.

      • Frank N

        MarkIsWrong, non-military people have their money taken from them with threats of violence, or violence if they don’t comply. It’s not like voluntarily paying for security. They have opinions, but they don’t have a say in what happens to their money after it is stolen.

      • Mom of 4

        Not everyone can serve in the military. My son tried to get into the Air Force and was turned down because of his asthma. He was told that every other branch of the military would turn him down because of his asthma. So don’t lump everyone together – that’s uncool.

      • Eliot

        I have 4 brothers who were military, 2 of them career military, and one has the bronze star for valor. My grandfather was in the secret service of the president. And yet, one must face facts that this is not the same country it was even 30 years ago. I discovered just how feminized this country has become on 9/11, when men all over town were wringing their hands and saying things like, “I hope they don’t hurt us.” My own reaction was, “Where’s my gun? I can take some of them with me if they come for us.”

      • Eliot

        @Mark: you are one of the feminized ones. Go put your pink slippers on.

      • TJ

        You aren’t serving the country, we have wide open borders, if there are no borders there is no country. As long as Obama’s illegal Aunt Zeituni is getting free housing while we have veterans going homeless, you are fooling yourself on what you think you are serving.

      • Mark

        Eliot, You are obviously not very intelligent. You know nothing about me. It appears as though you equate superior intelligence with “feminism.” Go back to your burger flipping job and leave the important decisions to those of us who have chosen to become educated.

      • EJ

        @ Mark: Eliot does have the right to deduce a few things about you. Your sweeping generalization tells us quite a bit about how you think. You jump to conclusions like a seasoned conspiracy theorist. You also have a healthy ego. In your follow up post, after ranting about Eliot’s character judgement you willfully did the same thing, and in a similar juvenial fashion. So this behavior is obviously okay for you while not for Eliot. But you take it one step further and assume that your intelligence is superior. Your uber-sensitive reaction also highlights a bit of insecurity. So I humbly deduce that you tend to be an insecure, self-absorbed conspiracy theorist. Now you can say “well, he started it!”, but that would only add the word “immature” to my deduction. So let’s just calm down a bit. After all, it is said that if you throw a stick into a pack of dogs, the one who yelps is the one who got hit.

      • Michael

        Well done EJ

      • Respect USA

        So Mark you are saying the one that feeds your pie hole is not intelligent enough to have a say in America. As one that runs a multi million dollar food operation you should worry more about the one that will spit on your burger after flipping it. America was built on the backs of immigrants coming to this Country for a better life. They would take any job to provide for their family. You should be proud of someone willing to keep your family safe when you put your head on your pillow at night. You should be ashamed.

      • Frank N

        USArmyCombatMedic, you have not chosen to serve your fellow human beings that are living in the same geographical area. You have chosen to serve your political masters who take people’s money with guns and give that money to you. If the military was a voluntarily funded defensive agency, then I would be very thankful to people were willing to risk their lives to defend others and their property. That is not what the US military is.

      • raindog

        I don’t believe for a second that you’re a combat medic. It’s just your name. You want people to think that the judge must have been right in this insane decision if a combat medic agrees with him. First of all, they didn’t have an actual flag wrapped around them, just a printed image on their shirts. You’re taking the title of the article literally. Secondly, there should never, ever be a time that’s it’s not OK to display an image of our flag within our own country. Anyone who causes a disruption because of an image of their own flag being displayed is the person at fault.

  • beegee17

    LOL! What would you expect from California!

    • Edward Boothe

      Maybe that’s why they call it Mexifornia

    • Edward Boothe

      Wait until Obama gets hes second term, all American flags are coming down

      • Edward Boothe

        The Mexican Organization, La Raza, which Obama supports, has a program called La Reinquista, meaning in English “the taking back” The program applies to California, New Mexico, Arizona, and Texas. It is well under away in California. Obama has personally addressed this organization.

    • CARMEN


      • cwt

        Just the fact that the expectation is that wearing an American flag on Cinco de Mayo will incite violence says something… and I don’t deny that it might incite violence, but the violent ones should be punished. Double-think at its finest…

      • Andy

        No Carmen, they got the idea from gutless cowards like you

  • Danny Nix

    Another OSU to be replaced.

  • Bess

    So now our American flag is a disruption to the classroom? Disgusting.

    If you don’t like our country, feel free to leave.

    • Edward Boothe

      The American flag is a disruption of Communism.

    • Edward Boothe

      It’s a disruption to Communism.

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        Thanks, Edward Boothe, we read it the first time.

    • USArmyCombatMedic

      The American flag should never be worn. Period. While I think these students were trying to make a valid point regarding cinco de mayo, they should be aware of proper flag etiquette.

      United States Code, Title 4, Chapter 1, Section 8: “The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free.” & “No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform.”

      • Hans

        Section 3 of the Flag Code defines the flag – for the purpose of clarifying what is inappropriate apparel – as any picture or representation of the flag purporting to be of the flag of the United States of America. It is the image that we are talking about, not the mere material. The image of the flag of the United States on apparel is inappropriate. Wikipedia is our friend.

      • commonlogic

        Nonsense. Flag etiquette has to do with an actual flag and has nothing to do with this and symbolic representations of our flag.

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        @Tim: Awesome. I was waiting for someone to either bring Pres. Bush or Pres. Obama into this debate. It is sad that our POTUS would rather not wear a flag lapel pin, as every other POTUS has done in recent memory. But as a soldier, and I’m sure you can understand this, it is not my place to direct a sitting President of the United States, my Commander in Chief, on what to wear.

        I’ll take how I feel to the polling booth. I implore you to as well.

      • ArmyVetAndLawyer

        The code means what it says. It does not mean that making a shirt with a flag print on it is considered a flag and thus should never be wore. This code is directed at actual flags and what can be done with actual U.S.A. flags!

        Medic, Boy Scout, and the others are reading too much into the meaning of the code. You cannot take a U.S. flag (an actual flag) and then use that flag as apparel. You can make a shirt and then put a flag print/pattern on it. If you can’t see the difference then the problem lies with you. The shirt was not magically turned into a flag just because the print that was on it. It was not made from a flag. So durbustweeb you are wrong as well.

      • American

        That applies to actual flags ninrod, not clothing.

      • BSPreventer

        Phony post from a lying liberal radical posing as a “combat army medic.”

      • aidan65

        I understand the “honoring” of the flag, but not being able to show your support of the flag and all that it stands for seems absurd to me. I WILL wear a flag and I WILL be proud and I WILL feel “honored” to wear it as it is my country, my history and I am proud!

      • Ernie

        You are actually 100% right on the US code and flag etiquette but I praise the students and parents for standing up to multi-culturalism run amok.

      • Dave Turner

        Ed Stark is correct. I remember back in elementary school in the mid 60’s when a girl wore a dress that resembled an American flag but was obvious to all the second grade students that it wasn’t, there was still a teacher who told her that she couldn’t wear the dress at school.

        The code clearly states that the flag itself nor any part of it should not be used as a costume or athletic uniform. If indeed we do believe that any representation of the flag is improper etiquette by the original poster’s interpretation then I would submit that the US Armed Forces are violating said statue by the inclusion of flag patches on military uniforms.

      • Warren

        Pharisee!!! Do you not see the freedom lost for the flag flying in your face???? would you rather have; a bad representation of the flag worn with pride, or your freedom of speech and expression taken from you? Wake up!. I see your title as US Army Combat Medic and I ask you, would you use the flag to stop the bleeding of one of your brothers in arms if it meant saving his life?? I bet you would. That cloth is nothing more than a rag if we lose all the freedoms it represents. I hear you saying what you are saying but understand what is being lost with the ruling and bring your codes up at your next community meeting.

      • Mark

        So are you saying that virtually every presidential candidate who wears a flag pin is violating the US Code?

      • Ed Stark

        Your point is invalid. They were wearing clothing with the flag on it, not wearing flags as capes or something.

        This is pure garbage from the left, plain and simple. They hate our country, hate what it means to be truly American, and will go to any length to destroy it even if it means harboring a corrupt 3rd world culture and pushing it’s propagation rather than assimilation.

      • Troy

        Thank you for that. I agree with you about the proper flag etiquette. All educational organizations should be teaching our proud heritage. However, I also think the students were trying to make a point and if the display of our flag inside our own country might cause “substantial disruption” then those that disrupt should be dealt with appropriately.

        Shame on the judge who can’t see the greater issue.

      • Mike

        They were not wearing the actual flag, which is prohibited in the articles you state above – just a shirt with a representation of the flag.


      • PAWatcher

        Thank you Medic, the flag is such an important part of US and should be treated properly…..breaks my heart to see it misused or abused. These boys sentiments were in the right place, young partriots. The court decision leaves me cold.

      • Sam

        Don’t all US military wear an American flag on their Class C’s? Thank you for your service.

      • gx

        it’s talking about wearing an actual flag, not a shirt with a flag design on it. Its respect for the actual flag itself not for a visual representation of the flag.

      • Matt Wessel

        Using the image of the flag is permitted, Re-purposing an actual flag as adornment or or anything other than it’s original purpose is not, Unless it is in time of emergency “i.e. bandages, shelter when stranded, etc.”

      • Gulf War Medic

        Well done.

        Instead of lawsuits, we need to step back and teach our kids the proper way of approaching things.


      • durbustweeb

        You are exactly right. It really bothers me to see the flag trivialized by making it into casual wear. The flag transcends bumper sticker statements or trendy political arguments. (Personally I think the overuse of the national anthem cheapens that as well.)

        Mark, don’t try to put your words in someone’s mouth. It’s rude, and in this case, misleading. Any person who knows the definition of the words “apparel, bedding, or drapery” can immediately recognize a flag pin falls outside of those definitions. Apparel means CLOTHING, for those unfamiliar with the word. It does NOT mean “anything that can be worn.”

      • David

        TITLE 4 > CHAPTER 1 > § 1

        Prev | Next
        So using exec orders, and your codes:

        § 1. Flag; stripes and stars on

        The flag of the United States shall be thirteen horizontal stripes, alternate red and white; and the union of the flag shall be forty-eight stars, white in a blue field.

        “Pursuant to 4 U.S.C. chapter 1, §§1, 2, & 3;Executive Order 10834, August 21, 1959; 24 F.R.6865; a military flag is a flag that resembles the regular flag of the United States, except that it has a YELLOW FRINGE border on three sides. ”

        That means all Courts / schools / public buildings that fly a Yellow Fringed flag is flying a ‘military flag’ – eg. under military law

      • Mike

        It’s ok to wear clothing with the flag on it. This states that you should not use actual flag banners as garment.

      • BoyScout

        If any one of these idiots would read the code they would understand what you were saying. It is sad that almost no one knows anything about flag etiquette anymore.
        A flag pin is OK. A flag patch is OK. Turning a flag into a tee shirt shows total disrespect. Wearing a flag as a bandana or do-rag, which I see all the time, shows the utmost disrespect. Read the code. Educate yourself. Learn to properly respect the flag before making some stupid emotional response to something you don’t understand.

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        @ Mark: No, of course not, because a “flag pin” is not a “flag”. If you were to blow that pin up to the size of wearable apparel, and wear solely that, then yes, I suppose it would be violating the Code. But thats not what we were discussing, is it?

        @EdStark: My point is not invalid. Yours shows little understanding of the Code. The clothing of these boys was not “clothing with a flag on it”, but rather, the entire shirt was depicted as a flag itself. Also, I’m going to overlook your comment about what I previously said being “pure garbage”. To say I “hate” my country, “hate what it means to be truly American” – that sir, is highly offensive.

        @Mike: the shirt did not have a picture of a flag on it, but rather, the entire shirt was a flag. see above…

        @Sam: Yes, we wear flag emblems on our uniforms. You are misunderstanding the Code.

        @PAWatcher: You’re welcome, from the bottom of my heart. It was not only an Honor to serve, it was a Privilege that I will never forget. Thank you for your support.

        @GulfWarMedic: Hooah brother.

      • Tim

        Then go tell Obama, who was embarassed into wearing a flag pin on his lapel.

      • durbustweeb

        ArmyVetandLawyer, the Supreme Court justice Potter Stewart stated “…I know it when I see it,…” regarding the definition of hard core pornography. A shirt is a shirt, and a flag is a flag. There comes a point when a t-shirt IS a flag, and though it wasn’t made from a flag it became a flag by what was put on the shirt. And I know it when I see it…

        I can certainly see your point about making something out of a flag versus putting the image of a flag on an item. Very lawyer-like, you split hairs well. Having to work with copyright law and building the corporate identities for large and small companies, as well as maintaining the corporate identities for many other clients with established identities, I have long understood the difference between what a logo or emblem IS versus what that logo or emblem represents. You being a lawyer brings nothing to the table as very few lawyers accurately understand copyright law, and unless it’s their specialty they tend to get their clients in trouble when arguing fair use and the finer points of logo reproduction.

        There isn’t law to cover this so the gray area of “right” and “wrong” use will continue. Legally there is nothing saying an object may not be made from a flag. The code doesn’t exist to be law; it is there to define what the flag is and how to respect it. These boys stated “they were proud to wear the flag.” In their minds they were wearing the American flag, and the illustration in the story would certainly give their reasoning credit. So, was it a shirt made into a flag? Was it a flag made into a shirt? Was it both? Neither?

        If it’s a picture of a flag on the shirt, isn’t a flag simply a piece of fabric with a picture of the flag on it, unless of course it is made from separate red, white and blue cloth?

        And of course none of this is as important as the garbage decisions that allow the administration of schools to bury the disgusting practices of political correctness. They are sniveling and spineless wimps that cost all us our liberty a little tiny step at a time.

      • Rick

        Well said; it truly disgusts me to see so called “Americans” wearing the flag as a piece of clothing. Obviously these students were not properly taught by their parents or the school that they should not deface our flag by wearing it as some sort of fashion apparel. It should fly high!

      • SeaBee Veteran

        The US Flag us routinely misused. The Washington Monument has 56 US Flags to represent the 50 states, DC and territories even though the US Flag is to represent the US only and a single flag should be flown. Any time you see more than one US Flag on a stage, it is being misused. The US Army uniform patch has the flag worn backwards with the field of stars to the right instead of the left.

      • spiney

        That backwards flag drives me (a little bit) crazy(ier) whenever I see it.

      • raindog

        You’re all wasting time talking about the flag code. That’s not what this case is about. The flag code isn’t a law. It has no relevance to this insane decision by a quack judge.

      • cyberties

        That’s all well and good, but that wasn’t why the courts or the school restricted the students from wearing the apparel. It had to do with their fear that the illegal immigrant kids would cop an attitude and start a riot. The principal did allow those same illegals to display the Mexican flag on Cinco de Mayo (which isn’t even celebrated in Mexico).

      • Marine

        You are incorrect. It’s a shirt not a flag and your perversion of what the code states is disturbing to say the least. A shirt with the symbol of a flag on it, isn’t a flag. Please stop peddling your ignorance as if somehow you know what thell you are talking about. Besides the judge rules that shirt (as recognized by the US Court, again it wasn’t recognized as a flag WISE UP!) was “likely to cause a substantial disruption.”. WISE UP and quit making the Army look like a bunch of Dumb Ass’s.

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        @BSPreventer: I am not a liberal. I am not a phony. For what it’s worth, I am a Christian, conservative Republican (leaning toward Cain but presently undecided). I am a US Army Combat Medic (68W). You were quick to discredit me, but laid no foundations for your claim.

        @ArmyVet&Lawyer: I see we will only disagree on this. I can live with that. However, if one were to take a shirt that had a flag print on it (the same as this student wore), and un-stitched it, what would it be? A flag, right? If it looks like a flag and quacks like a flag…. no, thats not right… Something like that. Humor aside, I hope you see my point. That said, I’m sure you still disagree. Ok…

      • Avenger

        They weren’t wearing a “flag”, they were wearing an image that was patterned after parts of the flag. I repeat: they were not wearing a flag! If you’re wearing a shirt with a picture of a horse, are you wearing a horse? How about some horse sense here. Where is Mr. Ed when you need him?

    • Mark

      Ed Stark: What is invalid about my point? USArmyCombatMedic said that the flag should never be be worn. I am 100% correct an totally on-point with my question. I think you are confused.

      • A . Murphy

        No..your point is invalid. As a patch or a pin representation the flag can be worn.

      • Fred

        You claim to be educated in your 11:41 post, yet you seem unable to discern between a flag and a flag pin. You are a dumba$$ and I bet you voted for Pelosi, didn’t you?

      • durbustweeb

        Mark, you’re completely mistaken. USArmyCombatMedic did not state the flag should never be worn. Perhaps the problem is how you perceive what was written.

        Turning an object into an non-traditional, casual flag is what the code is aimed at. You don’t transform the flag into an object other than its purpose as a flag. Having a massive print of the flag makes the object a variation of the flag with the primary use of the object fit the definition of apparel.

        Having the flag emblazoned on a pin or sewn on as a patch does not turn the patch or pin into apparel, as its primary use is to honor and respect the symbol represented in the flag.

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        @durbustweeb: Thank you. You clearly are more articulate than I. Thank you for explaining to others where I seem to have failed. This is not sarcasm. I mean it.

    • Mike

      If you do love this country feel free to fight for it

  • Chris Vitter

    Judge Ware should be ashamed of himself. What an idiot.

    • Dan Nelson

      There goes another right I fought for!

  • Jen Newman Rutsky

    How horrible. If they were wearing an anti-cinco de mayo shirt I’d understand the ruling but banning wearing a flag of the US? Ludicrous. I’m so sad for our country.

    • Michael

      Mr. Army guy you are clearly missing the point here of the court’s desicion. It has ZERO to do with how the flag is to be treated and clearly was a nod to the mexicans and liberals. Stop being so thick!!!

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        @Michael: First off, you may call me Army Guy. MR. Army Guy is my father…
        Second, I was not missing the point. Re-read my original post. I stated, “While I think these students were trying to make a valid point regarding cinco de mayo, they should be aware of proper flag etiquette”.. Then several other people decided to reply, and I (not wanting to appear rude) replied in turn. While the court’s decision has nothing to do with flag etiquette, my response plays into the whole 1st Amendment, Freedom of Expression ideal. Unless it is your view that I am not entitled to express myself freely in a public forum..

    • USArmyCombatMedic

      United States Code, Title 4, Chapter 1, Section 8: “The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free.” & “No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform.”

      While I support these students’ expression of free speech, they should be aware that wearing a flag is disrespectful to those of us willing to die for it.

      • durbustweeb

        This might be helpful to illustrate what USArmyCombatMedic is stating.

        Before it was easy to print the flag onto clothing this was a more cut-and-dry issue. The code basically gets down to the simple point that the flag serves ONE function, not two or three. It can’t be clothes and flag at the same time. It is an emblem of the nation, not a casual decoration.

        Conserv kat, there are some things that are important to define. There certainly didn’t appear to be disrespect towards either those willing to support others who would be willing to die for what the flag represents, or towards those who would or have actually been willing to die themselves for the values of freedom and liberty, such as chiefjoesph and USAArmyCombatMedic.

        We show respect to the values of the flag when we give it proper use. We cheapen it when we become overly casual. It’s kind of like respecting your parents because they are unique in your life versus respecting all of your elders because it’s generally the proper thing to do.

      • aidan65

        Wearing a flag IS the honor you feel you deserve. Why are you so confused and rigid? I think you stand alone on the “disrespectful to those of us willing to die for it”. It makes no sense. However, if you are trying to imply that the particular use of these shirts (possibly as an in your face tactic) was disrespectful, then THAT I can understand.

      • chiefjoesph

        Combat medic. I am a retired vet,three tours to Vietnam, and I wear a American flag patch on my jacket and a pin on my sport coat so I don’t need any lectures,thank you very much

      • Blank

        They weren’t wearing a “flag”. They were wearing a shirt with a depiction of the flag on part of it.

        In other words, you wouldn’t fly the shirt on a flagpole. The US code is speaking of using actual flyable flags as apparel (e.g. a toga, cape, etc)

      • conserv kat

        and you are splitting hairs and are being disrespectful to those of us who are willing to support those willing to die for it. THE SHIRTS WERE NOT MADE OF FLAGS!!!!!

      • USArmyCombatMedic

        @chiefjoseph: I too am a veteran. I served two tours in Iraq and 2 in Afghanistan. If you’ll scroll up, you’ll notice I wasn’t lecturing you. I was informing another person.

        It’s entirely irrelevant whether the shirt was made from the cloth of a flag. These students stated they were prod to wear an “American Flag Shirt”. However, those words should never be combined, as it is disrespectful to wear such an item.

        @Blank: Tell me, did the shirt have any other depiction on it? Did the shirt have a background with a flag emblazoned on the front or back of it? Or was the ENTIRE SHIRT designed to look like a flag itself?

        @conserv kat: I meant no disrespect. I thank you for your support, however, I feel I am also entitled to my freedom of expression, am I not? And it is my understanding (and that of the drill sergeants who instilled this in me) that this is a disrespectful act towards the American Flag. Hope that clears things up..

      • asdf@asdf.tld

        If you take a flag, and make it into something else, like apparel or bedding or drapery, that is disrespectful. If you take a T-SHIRT, or some curtains, and APPLY a depiction of a flag, that is entirely different.

  • Guest1

    “when it is likely to cause a substantial disruption.”

    So was there a disruption? Until such an event occurs, it’s just plain censorship.

    Effing commies!

    • Eric Hultman

      “material and substantial interference with schoolwork or discipline” is the legal standard.

      Its not speculative or potential disruption…

  • p. garbe


    • John Smith

      Don’t you mean secede?

  • Mike D.

    I’m a Canadian and this BS makes my blood boil.

  • appalled in DC

    That’s right boys and girls, you can’t wear an American flag to an American school in the United States of America for fear of inciting violence. Only in california

    • Old Fart

      I’m betting there were plenty of Mexican flags flying….

      • Ghstwolf

        Exactly what WAS happening. I remember when this story first broke and there were Mexican flags being hung from the rafters and on walls.
        The kids were wearing representations of the Mexican flag or otherwise displaying it and when the American kids and parents started complaining about it they were told it was Mexico’s day and any American display would be inappropriate. They feared the Mexicans would riot or something so banned any American flag or representation there of to be displayed. When the kids came to school with some form of display of the American flag, since this isn’t actually Mexico, the administration used the “Disturbance” rule against these kids because he was afraid the Mexicans would go off.
        My personal opinion is the same as two above. 1. If you don’t like it then leave, we sure don’t want you here and 2. Deal with the Mexicans who cause such a disturbance before showing such disrespect to our country IN our country.

        Oh and why in he** are we celebrating a foreign country’s holiday in the US anyway? I mean when was the last time we celebrated Bastille Day?

  • Andrew

    I doubt the school would have restricted the students if they were wearing the national flag of any other country. Amazing that we allow people to oversee our education system and government who are anti-American. If they hate this country so damn much as to deny Freedom of Speech which is GUARANTEED under United States Constitution…then instead of restricting us…they should just pack up and leave to some other country. Once they are there and they understand what freedoms they enjoyed here…maybe they would stop disrespecting our country.

    • Ghstwolf

      Yeah several prominent liberals a few years ago threatened to do that exact thing if Bush won the election but when it happened not a single one of them had the b*lls to actually go through with it.

      The school didn’t, they encouraged the Mexicans to celebrate and wear their country’s flag and for those who thought it inappropriate and wanted to display their pride in this country, well they got told to pi*s off.

  • dpk64


    • Gayle

      It’s not even a recognized holiday in Mexico. I believe September 16th is the holiday that is celebrated in Mexico. Cinco de Mayo is just another excuse for americans to get drunk. Kind of like St. Patricks day.

    • Ghstwolf

      There’s that nasty little word again. “Legally” No one wants to hear it. They’re even trying to make “Illegal” a word not to be used when referring to illegal aliens because its offensive to the illegals.

      The problem we have goes back to when someone somewhere thought and continues to think that ILLEGALS have Constitutional Rights. They don’t because they’re not citizens of this country which would afford them such.

  • Brees List : Veteran’s Day .. 2011

    […] and as they fight for our freedom on far off shores … our freedom is being stripped bit by big bit right before our eyes right within our own shores. Posted by admin on Friday, November 11, 2011, at 1:44 pm. Filed under Politics and […]

  • Prester John

    Yet wearing and waving Mexican flags is not a disruption.

    Makes sense to me.

  • carl

    This is a music video tribute from my family to all those who watch over
    us and give their lives to keep us free!

    • PAWatcher

      Thank you Carl and family for your service to US. The song became one of my favorites on the spot, will pass it to my family and friends.

  • Philip Nolan

    This is disrespectful of all the men and women who have died defending that flag and all it stands for. Among which is freedom of speech and expression.

    Down with tyrants.

  • James R.

    Welcome to the Peoples Republik of California. You, the residents of California elected the officials who appoint these judges. Your deserve the government you’ve got.

    • Ron

      James R., you “nailed it”. !!!!!

    • PAWatcher

      Local government is the foundation and as a pyamid should taper at the tip/Washington, DC. You are right James we get what we vote for at home. Keeping an eye on PA local politics more closely than I ever have.

      • Michael

        I live in Bucks County PA and I am very sad to say that our local elections were nearly swept by liberals this past Tuesday. I just dont understand nor will I ever understand the liberal mind. It goes counter to all that seems logical and normal to me.

      • PAWatcher

        Pyramid, sorry about the misspelling.


    Take your children out of the government run schools.

  • JustAGuy

    This is California! You’re not allowed to wear the American flag. But you can wear the Mexican flag all you want!

    ¡Viva La Raza!

  • chiefjoesph

    It seems that in California the only one group that have 1st Amendment rights are the illegals and their anchor babies. If you are a American the liberals want to strip you of your rights under the constitution. The liberals(progressives) view the constitution as outmoded in todays world and would dearly love to shred it into little pieces. The Democrats are leading the charge for a one world goverment with them in charge.

  • Rammrodd

    When are the people going to stand up and throw these “judges” out on their ears? It’s TIME people! Rise up and take our country back!!!

    • Ghstwolf

      Actually many years ago in California we did just that and did it big time recalling several Supreme Court Judges including the Chief Justice who kept making their liberal BS rulings, overturning voter approved measures and just generally being extremely liberal. Sadly that time seems to have passed and small enclaves like SF rule the rest of the state. Outside these blue enclaves most of the state is red.

      Sadly I don’t think you will see it happening again.

  • amplitude jones

    the school should have banned criminal pig invader mexicans for fear of violence- since they are the criminal PIGS who do violence.

  • The Gun Makes The Law

    Although the price has gone up substantially in the last 12 months, one can still get an AK-47 for about $425.

  • Benmoshe

    I hope that this idiotic decision is appealed up through the system until it gets out of the California Circut and to a court where there is honor and respect for our country and our flag. Also, on this Veteran’s Day…Thank you to all of my comrads who are serving or have served our country – stay safe.

    • Ghstwolf

      I wonder if the oh so concerned about 1st amendment rights ACLU was anywhere to be seen defending these kids.

      Bet not

      • Ghstwolf

        I’ll be happy to admit when I’m wrong. In this case I am wrong. And yes you are right I don’t like the ACLU at all for a number of reasons and you can’t tell me there aren’t enough things they do that are worth finding fault with.

        For some reason I couldn’t reply directly to your post so am doing it this way.

      • spiney

        Eh, I’m not too fond of them either when they defend (for example) the Klan, but they’re pretty damn consistent in support of free speech.

      • spiney

        Bet you’re wrong.

        Bet you’re really wrong.

        But don’t let the facts get in the way of your ACLU bashing.

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